Well, this is a tough one to swallow. In order for a very harmful action to be justified, there has to be evidence that there is absolutely no other way to accomplish the best outcome. Consistent with the definition of the word "villain", a vast majority of villains don't put in the sincere effort necessary to justify the supposedly ideal outcome they seek to achieve. They usually act out of any combination of the seven deadly sins, unethical ways, believiable pseudoscience or pure delusion, rather than selfless desperation. Now, see, so Zod in The Man of Steel, is an interesting case, because he is trying to save his people as he had vowed to do, and he had no obligations whatsoever to humanity. This is very understandable, seeing as how a vast majority of human beings in the exact same position would behave the same way, when it comes to weighing the needs of the in-group against the needs of the out-group. Hell, history repeatedly repeats itself (and will continue to) in that particular regard, to the point that arguably it is the moral way to be. We've tried to ban genocide, but clearly this is no solid enforcement mechanism, and the idea that anybody is capable of wielding such power in an always justifiable way is questionable, seeing as how democide could sometimes be a bigger issue than genocide.
I would suggest hedging or qualifying a bit in your poll suggestion. Both the title and question make the situation seem black and white. Plus, your question doesn't allow for more than the option to be right to be answered correctly. What if the two answer options were right or if every option was right? How should I answer? Plus, as asked, I don't know if you are asking me about being right about their motives or about being right in actions taken in response to motives as depicted in the movie? I would suggest being more specific, allowing for degrees of rightness or justifications and expanding your question a bit. I posted a version below, I am sure you can find a balance between my example and the short one used now (especially considering there nothing other than the title to expand on the topic and better understand the theme).
Superhero Movie Villains With Justifiable Motives
Which villain with possibly justified motives in these movies do you think was the most right in both their motive and actions taken in response?
Well, I've been trying to prepare some option descriptions to provide for consideration. What I have thus far (with some blanks yet to be filled in) is as follows:
Name
Situation/Motive
(Tone)
Erik Lensherr
For the threat they pose to mutated humans, non-mutant lives are to be forfeit or subjugated under his agenda.
(Serious)
Thanos
Himself exempted, a random half of all lifeforms in the universe are to be erased under his agenda.
(Serious)
Edward Nygma
Incels deserve to be heard by any means necessary under his agenda?
(Sarcasm)
Orn,
King of Atlantis
Kingpin
Harvey Dent
Whether a violent criminal is to live or die by his vigilante hand is decided by the outcome of a coin toss.
(Serious)
David Hyde
Gorr
the God Butcher
Arthur Fleck
The life of any man who so much as humiliates him is to be forfeit under his pattern of behavior.
(No joke)
Syndrome
Xu Wenmu
Helmut Zemo
He frames the Bucky Barnes for the murder of T'Chaka, King of Wakanda, and even commits torture in order to uncover enoug hinformation to bring an end to an assassination-driven mind control program.
(Serious)
Flint Marko
Adrian Veidt
He frames Jon Osterman for simultaneous events of mass destruction around the world in order to dissuade the Western bloc and the Soviet bloc from partaking in hostilities that would entail mutually-assured destruction, by uniting them against what they beleive to be a common enemy.
(Serious)
Selena Kyle
According to her, the world would be a better place without Max Shreck and other men who brutalize women in it.
(Serious)
Starro
Wanda Maximoff
She resurrects her significant other at the expense of the liberty and free will of the entire population of a small town. After letting her phantom love go, she then wants back her sons that she magically-conceived with him and will travel across the multiverse to abduct them from an alternate timeline, destroying anybody who stands in her way.
(Serious)
Robert Callaghan
William Stryker
For the threat they pose to humanity, mutant lives are to be forfeit or subjugated under his agenda.
Sebastian Shaw
For the threat they pose to mutated humans,, non-mutant lives are to be forfeit or subjugated under his agenda.
(Serious)
Victor Trask
He deprives mutants of their liberty and well-being in order to build effective countermeasures against them, so that humanity can be protected from harm.
(Serious)
Quentin Beck
Zod
He would sacrifice the lives of every inhabitant of earth in order to build a new home world to ensure the survival of his own people.
(Serious)
Nuada Silverlance
Namor,
King of Talokan
The life of a scientist responsible for creating Vibranium-detecting device is forfeit under his agenda. Plus, he intends to defeat the surface regimes before they have a chance to harvest enough Vibranium to pose a credible threat to Talokan and Wakanda; kind of like trying to win a war before it starts.
(Serious)
Ichirō Yashida
Ava Starr
She is pilfering a precious resource upon which her life depends.
Gaps in the above exist because I either haven't seen or need to see again the movie corresponding to a particular villain. So, for example, I need to see Aquaman again to make sure I comprehend what was going on with Manta and Orn, likewise with Spider-Man 3 for Sandman, Far from Home for Mysterio, Big Hero 6 for Yokai, and The Wolverine for Samurai. Whereas the remaining blanks reflect that I've not even seen a particular movie in full or don't even remember the bits and pieces that I did see.
O, and maybe somebody ought to create a poll suggestion for the scummiest antagonist ever portrayed by Paul Dano. He wasn't a villain in L.I.E. and I adored him in that, but I couldn't stand his characters in The Batman, 12 Years a Slave, Looper and There Will Be Blood, while I can hardly remember how I felt about The Newcomers and The Girl Next Door. I have Okja in my Flix list, but I've not gotten around to seeing it. He had better not be playing a villain in that.
jeorj_euler
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4 months ago
Well, this is a tough one to swallow. In order for a very harmful action to be justified, there has to be evidence that there is absolutely no other way to accomplish the best outcome. Consistent with the definition of the word "villain", a vast majority of villains don't put in the sincere effort necessary to justify the supposedly ideal outcome they seek to achieve. They usually act out of any combination of the seven deadly sins, unethical ways, believiable pseudoscience or pure delusion, rather than selfless desperation. Now, see, so Zod in The Man of Steel, is an interesting case, because he is trying to save his people as he had vowed to do, and he had no obligations whatsoever to humanity. This is very understandable, seeing as how a vast majority of human beings in the exact same position would behave the same way, when it comes to weighing the needs of the in-group against the needs of the out-group. Hell, history repeatedly repeats itself (and will continue to) in that particular regard, to the point that arguably it is the moral way to be. We've tried to ban genocide, but clearly this is no solid enforcement mechanism, and the idea that anybody is capable of wielding such power in an always justifiable way is questionable, seeing as how democide could sometimes be a bigger issue than genocide.
0
0
Peter_pbn
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3 months ago
Please correct:
Which villain was right?
And the title is probably better with singular movie:
Superhero Movie Villains with Justifiable Motives
0
urbanemovies
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3 months ago
# 9 Two-Faces should be Two-Face
He had only one face, but it had two sides.
1
urbanemovies
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148.8K Points
3 months ago
FYC,
I would suggest hedging or qualifying a bit in your poll suggestion. Both the title and question make the situation seem black and white. Plus, your question doesn't allow for more than the option to be right to be answered correctly. What if the two answer options were right or if every option was right? How should I answer? Plus, as asked, I don't know if you are asking me about being right about their motives or about being right in actions taken in response to motives as depicted in the movie? I would suggest being more specific, allowing for degrees of rightness or justifications and expanding your question a bit. I posted a version below, I am sure you can find a balance between my example and the short one used now (especially considering there nothing other than the title to expand on the topic and better understand the theme).
Superhero Movie Villains With Justifiable Motives
Which villain with possibly justified motives in these movies do you think was the most right in both their motive and actions taken in response?
(edited)
0
Pencho15
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3 months ago
It may be useful to mention what were their motives
1
dan_dassow
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454.3K Points
3 months ago
@gabriel_gomez_v1f5ssvze4xd ,
The word "With" should be capitalized in the title of your poll.
Please change the title of your poll from:
Superhero Movie Villains with Justifiable Motives
To:
Superhero Movie Villains With Justifiable Motives
1
0
dan_dassow
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2 months ago
@gabriel_gomez_v1f5ssvze4xd ,
I'm wondering whether the word "justifiable" is too strong of a word for your poll. Maybe "understandable" may be a better word.
Please consider changing:
Superhero Movie Villains With Justifiable Motives
Which villain had justifiable motives?
with
Superhero Movie Villains With Understandable Motives
Which villain had the most understandable motives?
(edited)
3
jeorj_euler
9.9K Messages
•
212.8K Points
2 months ago
Well, I've been trying to prepare some option descriptions to provide for consideration. What I have thus far (with some blanks yet to be filled in) is as follows:
Orn,
King of Atlantis
Kingpin
Harvey Dent
Gorr
the God Butcher
She resurrects her significant other at the expense of the liberty and free will of the entire population of a small town. After letting her phantom love go, she then wants back her sons that she magically-conceived with him and will travel across the multiverse to abduct them from an alternate timeline, destroying anybody who stands in her way.
For the threat they pose to humanity, mutant lives are to be forfeit or subjugated under his agenda.
Namor,
King of Talokan
2
0