ind3's profile

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Thursday, November 16th, 2023 9:33 AM

In Progress

Name suffixes

The name guide states: Suffixes indicating professional affiliation, like ASC, CSA, MPSE, etc., are never included; such guild memberships can be noted in biographical trivia. https://help.imdb.com/article/contribution/names-biographical-data/names/GSA3M6SFHRAERXZ3?ref_=helpms_helpart_inline#suffix

There seem to be several contributors who don't understand the policy, so these types of credits have to be corrected repeatedly. Will a staff member point out the guide to however many people are doing this?

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Employee

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57.9K Points

1 year ago

Hi @ind3 -

The attributes were reflecting the on-screen credits, we will confirm with our policy team since the rule you mentioned is for creating name pages, so we will check if it applies for filmography attributes.

Cheers!

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2.8K Points

@Bethanny

Just to clarify or add some background, the policy has always been not to add them in attributes as well, which is why you almost never see them on the site. In the past, they wouldn't even have been accepted, and when someone would ask about their submission on the older proprietary help board, the above guide would be pointed out to them. One of the reasons for this is that there are often several variations of the same credit. So for example, instead of having a page for a John Doe and listing the guilds as trivia items, the page would have John Doe C.A.S., John Doe c.a.s., John Doe cas, John Doe CAS, John Doe MPSE, John Doe M.P.S.E., John Doe C.A.S. M.P.S.E., John Doe CAS MPSE, etc. as alternate names in addition to all of the inevitable typos: John Doe C.A.S, John Doe MPS, John Doe C.S.A., etc. This was basically junking up the name pages when none of these are really alternate names to begin with. This is not really of interest to the casual user, so it's my understanding that this is why they were historically not accepted and contributors were not encouraged to add them. If the policy is changed, then basically every cinematographer, sound person, casting director, etc. are going to have these types of alternate names listed.

Employee

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312.5K Points

1 year ago

Note: There is an error with Michelle's comment in this thread displaying the text of other replies to the thread.

(p.g.a.) is already an attribute, and the producers guidelines say that is where it should be added:

The Producers Mark has to be submitted as separate attribute in lowercase letters separated by periods, e.g. "(produced by) (p.g.a.)".

This is also a slightly confusing wording since "produced by" tends to be added in the occupation field and (p.g.a.) in the attribute field.

(edited)

247 Messages

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2.8K Points

@Michelle

Thanks, but can you point out the guide and the policy to the contributors in the initial post, because they don't seem to understand. Part of the problem is that people will add these types of credits when someone is already listed, and then the duplicates have to be deleted.

For example:

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221101-083613-859000

Employee

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@ind3​ Hi!

Steps were taken to avoid this.

Cheers!

Employee

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5.5K Messages

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57.9K Points

@ind3​ Hi! Since they are coming from different submitters and there is no bad intention behind it, just lack of knowledge of the rule, I have created a ticket V1227366691 to check if there is a way to detect and warn users before submission.

Cheers!

2.7K Messages

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82.7K Points

@Michelle​ "with the exception of the on-screen Producer credit "P.G.A", we do not allow professional accreditation to be listed with name texts"

Why is that? The producer guide (https://help.imdb.com/article/contribution/filmography-credits/producers/G4ZQC6Z8XV2P8ZZX?ref_=helpsrall#) also doesn't explain why this exception is being made.

And on the other hand, the Suffixes and Prefixes guide (https://help.imdb.com/article/contribution/names-biographical-data/names/GSA3M6SFHRAERXZ3?ref_=helpsrall#suffix) doesn't mention the exception for producers.

Champion

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275.8K Points

@Bethanny​ I agree with Marco. "P.G.A." should not be treated as part of a producer's credited name on IMDb. It is more like a job title.

This is somewhat different from suffixes such as "A.C.E." (American Cinema Editors) or "B.S.C." (British Society of Cinematographers) which are used to signify membership in a particular organization. Once an editor/cinematographer has one of those designations, if I understand correctly, they can use that suffix on all their future credits in that job.

However, the "P.G.A." producers mark indicates that the person did the work of a producer on the film as certified by the Producers Guild of America, rather than just being given the title of producer without putting in the work. As explained on the PGA's website:

No. The Producers Mark is not a membership mark. It is a certification mark that is owned by the PGA and licensed to a producer for his or her work on a particular feature-length motion picture based upon that producer having performed a major portion of the producing functions on that motion picture in a decision-making capacity. To apply for use of the Producers Mark, the motion picture’s copyright owner or other person or business entity legally authorized to designate the producing credits that appear onscreen in the motion picture’s release within the United States must complete a Notice of Producing Credits Form. The Producers Mark may be used only following a determination issued by the PGA granting the producer the right to use “p.g.a.” behind his or her name. ...

No. You do not need to be a member of the PGA to submit to or participate in the Producers Mark certification or awards eligibility determination process.

Hence, a person could receive the "P.G.A." certification on one film but not receive it on their next film, if the Producers Guild determines that the person did not do the active work of producing the second film.

If possible, I suggest that (p.g.a.) be made an eligible attribute for producers, instead of allowing it as part of an alternate name, so that IMDb can indicate which producers on a film received the Producers Mark certification for that film.

Champion

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(p.g.a.) is already an attribute, and the producers guidelines say that is where it should be added:

The Producers Mark has to be submitted as separate attribute in lowercase letters separated by periods, e.g. "(produced by) (p.g.a.)".

This is also a slightly confusing wording since "produced by" tends to be added in the occupation field and (p.g.a.) in the attribute field.