Keywords spoilers on title main pages

Spoilers  SHOULD NOT generally be deleted from keywords IF the keywords are to accurately represent the content of a title.

It's weird that this has to be pointed out, but of course this is true. Correct information should never be deleted.

How do you not read something you are looking at? There's always some joker who posts this physical impossibility as a solution.

As there is currently no way to hide keyword spoilers, the only solution is to delete them. Not spoiling the viewing experience for others always takes precedence over accuracy. This is why reviews with spoilers are hidden even though they would technically be more accurate.

"Not spoiling the viewing experience for others"? My viewing experience would be spoiled IF the supposedly offensive keywords were deleted.  Don't look at them if you don't want to know ...and,. most certainly, DO NOT read the Plot Synopsis before  viewing a title!  Then, you would know even more! Heaven forbid!

As already pointed out, there is currently no way to not view the keywords when scrolling down the page and likewise with the primary summary and synopsis (as opposed to the full list list of summaries and synopses which can only be seen when selected) and thus there is no way for a typical reader not to see, and therefore read, these items.

If you are able to selectively read parts of pages, congratulations, but this is not an ability most people share; thus any item with spoilers will and should continue to be flagged or deleted until IMDB implements a change which addresses the keyword spoiler issue. 

Note also that keywords are intended to be used as descriptive tags for the purposes of searching and categorization and therefore do not need to be visible to perform their intended function. If you actively use keywords when viewing pages then you should make that point, perhaps even starting your own thread that they should be more prominent if that would facilitate how you use IMDB, rather than making unrealistic suggestions that dismiss the issue at hand.

No, the only solution is not to delete them.  As I suggested about 5 months ago, just move the list to a separate page, keeping the link on the main page, possibly with an advisory notice that linking to the keywords may reveal spoilers. 

It's not rocket science, and it's technically simple to do.  So why won't IMDb do this?  They've removed spoilers from everywhere else on the main page.  Let's get with the program!

As there is currently no way to hide keyword spoilers, the only solution is to delete them.

Well, there is reference view: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt6723592/reference.....

Just to be clear, for those who read this comment from @Peter_pbn​:

According to IMDb you should use the 'relevance' feature to move spoiler keywords down:

Here is what @Col_Needham said on that other thread:

Our recommendation here is to . . . vote the other keywords higher

So to be clear, if people regard a keyword as a spoiler and don't like that, they should upvote other relevant keywords so that they appear higher in the list. 

Although I know @Peter_pbn did not intend to imply this, people should not downvote relevant keywords just because they regard those keywords as spoilers. Rather, the way to handle that is indirectly by upvoting other keywords, as discussed above.

Finally, as @Col_Needham also raises in that other thread, very few keywords are immediately recognized as spoilers regardless of context. Some examples of such keywords, which I have mentioned elsewhere in this thread, are  death of mother and death of father. IMDb already handles those few keywords by automatically putting them at the bottom of each keyword list. 

There may be a few other similar keywords, such as death of parents, that should always be placed at the bottom of each keyword list. Anyone who identifies such a keyword can recommend that IMDb treat it the same way  death of mother and death of father are already treated.

@Marco​

Reference view is definitely a good solution, but it is not foolproof.

Reference view simply displays keywords in a different manner than normal view. As best as I can tell, reference view displays the first 5 keywords that were originally added to each title, regardless of who added those keywords and regardless of subsequent relevance voting.

This is sort of a glitch with reference view, where it does not take keyword relevance into account. But I actually like this glitch, because (for keyword research purposes) it allows me to understand which keywords were the first ones added to a title.

When I add keywords to a title page that doesn't already have any, I usually take care to add the spolierific ones (especially twist-revealing ones) after all the others.

I on the other hand am watching the movie and entering the keywords as they are appearing.  That way I can also pause and rewind if needed to make sure it is accurate.  This also places any "Ending" surprise as the last items entered.

I do take often take notes when watching (or rather re-watching) a movie, in preparation to make contributions to IMDb, but I often won't allow the data entry ordering to necessarily reflect the order of elements as they appeared or transpired on screen. So, for instance, with the parental guide, I seek to order items primarily by severity or shock value, leaving the running time aspect as a secondary consideration. I used to transcribe credits directly into the submission form, but I've found it easier, faster and more comfortable to just type them out (in a shorthand notation) into a word processor first, to avoid errors, confusion or the risk of the submission form malfunctioning. I don't really bother to take notes for elements intended to be keywords, because the way I see it, if I can't remember a particular element after the end of the movie, then the element probably isn't immediately worthy of being documented with keyword to correspond.

@jeorj_euler 

I noticed that even though I enter them in as they appear, they normally never end up in the order I entered them.  I don't think really it makes a difference on how you enter it because the relevance thing kicks in on the site.  As @keyword_expert stated before 

very few keywords are immediately recognized as spoilers regardless of context. Some examples of such keywords, which I have mentioned elsewhere in this thread, are  death of mother and death of father. IMDb already handles those few keywords by automatically putting them at the bottom of each keyword list. 

It really does not matter the order you enter it, because it will end up different anyway.

I'm used to the way title reference view works, though. I hadn't really thought about the way current generation design as it corresponds to title pages functions, and I assumed that the sample of keywords that appear on it are automatically selected from the highest-voted or earliest-entered keywords.

When I add keywords to a title page that doesn't already have any, I usually take care to add the spolierific ones (especially twist-revealing ones) after all the others.

@jeorj_euler​ Yes, me too. And among the non-spoilerific keywords, I try to add the most important ones first. 

@jeorj_euler​

I don't really bother to take notes for elements intended to be keywords, because the way I see it, if I can't remember a particular element after the end of the movie, then the element probably isn't immediately worthy of being documented with keyword to correspond.

This is (usually) my approach as well. The way I see it, the only plot points worthy of keywords are those that can be remembered once I am home after seeing a movie in the theater. After all, the IMDb guidelines tell us to only include "notable" plot points as keywords. 

@ZacGates_BDS​

It really does not matter the order you enter it, because it will end up different anyway.

That is incorrect. Keywords will always appear on a keyword page in the order you enter them. The exceptions are keywords that have received "relevant" or "not relevant" votes, plus the new system of categorizing keywords as viewed on smartphones, plus the very few keywords that IMDb places at the bottom of each keyword page automatically. 

Plus, the order you enter keywords will also be retained for all keywords that receive "relevant" votes. For example, if I enter 50 keywords and 10 of them each get 1 "relevant" vote, those 10 keywords will advance to the top, but they will still be presented in the order I submitted them. 

It is also possible to sort keywords alphabetically, but that isn't the default display. 

@jeorj_euler​

I'm used to the way title reference view works, though. I hadn't really thought about the way current generation design as it corresponds to title pages functions, and I assumed that the sample of keywords that appear on it are automatically selected from the highest-voted or earliest-entered keywords.

For reference view, the earliest-entered keywords are listed first. For standard view, the highest-voted (most relevant) keywords are listed first. 

@Sandy​ How do you not look at something on the page you are viewing? As you have pointed out, you are the third person to suggest this physical impossibility rather than suggesting a viable solution such as having IMDB hide keywords (as they do with other spoilers) or move them to their own page (as they have done with other sections).

I hate to say this however i hope no one is deleting any keywords even if you feel it is a spoiler. A spoiler to you may not be a spoiler to someone else.  It is in the eye of the beholder.   

When I look for things quickly on IMDB, I hit the keywords first before reading any plot.  I find out more information from those keywords then I have ever done from a plot.   

I would prefer they remain right where they are with easy access to them.  

Maybe instead of trying to remove them like people are suggesting may be a better way is to have a customization where in settings you can turn them off or on.

HOWEVER NEVER DELETE KEYWORDS!!!!!!!!!  You are just removing someone hard work that than someone else will have to add back in.

Why can't those tags only be reveleaded with a click (or even on mouse over),

Like this? https://web.archive.org/web/20100328143714/https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0068646/

Here is something else to think about.  Why should things be done in such a way to make it more difficult for half the users, just because a few thinks a word is a spoiler when others don't?  Having it with rollovers or moving them to another page forcing people to make extra clicks and then have to go back to the main page.  I think a simple setting in our profiles can make everyone happy.  Those that think keywords are spoilers can set to off on their account and those that like them can keep them on.  It can be simply added to the coding to do this.

@ZacGates_BDS​ I doubt half the IMDB user base prefers seeing inadvertent spoilers to a mouse-over or click-reveal, but your idea to make showing keywords by default a user preference is valid suggestion; however, it would still require the mouse-over/click-reveal to be coded into the main page to reveal the keywords to those users so that seems to be the logical first step to solve this problem.

Like you, I'd prefer to see keywords by default, and an alternate solution could be IMDB implementing a predefined list of keywords to choose from to prevent people from adding spoilers. New keywords could be submitted for review and approval as part of the same step that occurs every time a title page is edited. This option would require little more effort from the IDMB team than a copy/paste of the same code used for every other title page edit.

@ZacGates_BDS​ I certainly hope no-one is re-adding spoiler keywords after they have been deleted. Anyone intentionally spoiling a movie should be reported and banned.

@KADC​ First don't put words in my mouth that I did not say you took what I said and twisted in into something else.  That is wrong of you to do that!

 your idea to make showing keywords by default a user preference is valid suggestion; however, it would still require the mouse-over/click-reveal to be coded into the main page to reveal the keywords to those users so that seems to be the logical first step to solve this problem.

What I also suggested will never ever have to have a rollover/click-reveal added.  In you account setting now there are options a user can choice to change the way things look.  A simple yes no option of "display keywords (yes/no)" Then when the page is called up a simple if then statement is used.  If keywords is set to yes then it displays the keywords.  If the keywords is set to no then it displays a link instead.  Simple.  NO rollerovers or clicking needed,

I took a little survey last night of my coworkers.  Just for the reference I work in an independent film studio.  So, I am inside the industry.  This only meant as a reference to show where views are among one area and may not represent the overall picture of IMDB.  I asked questions to 25 people in the office about the keywords.  Here's the numbers I came up with.  of the 25 only 4% said they had issues with spoilers with keywords.   8% did not know there were keywords on a title page.  40% used keywords and never came across anything that was a spoiler. 48% said that they knew keywords where there but never paid attention to them.  Other things I asked was do you use IMDB to figure out what to watch?   44% said yes 56% said no.  of the 44% I asked what do you go there to find out?  ALL of them said they went there to find out information about the movie to see if it was right for their children to watch.  Per them, that information comes mostly from the keywords.  

When in my previous post I referred to 50% it was in reference to the fact that the minority of people that think there are spoilers in the keywords to the rest of the people that use IMDB and was not meant to be used the @KADC did in his post, you are miss interpreting what I said.

Even though my numbers came up with 8% I feel the numbers when looking at IMDB as a whole will be more like 20% think the keywords have spoilers, which is a minority of the users. 20% that heavily uses keywords (which is also a minority), like parents that need all the information that is in keywords including what a few MIGHT consider to be spoilers. There are probable about 12% that don't even know that there are keywords on IMDB.   That leave 30% that know that they are there however they don't look at the keywords, so they are not affected by them.  That leaves about 18% that don't even care about keywords. These are just educated guesses because no real study has ever been done to know for sure.  with that said @KADC travels in a circle with people he might know that if he did the same things asking he will get another number higher on the spoilers than what I did.  I am not saying its not wrong, its just a small survey I did and if he did it that would result in 2 different views of the same thing. It comes down to who you ask.

In my opinion since @KADC because he has admitted that he is deleting keywords that he be banned from deleting any more of people's hard work.  it is 100% wrong for @KADC to be doing this and should be reported to IMDB.  This action should be stopped ASAP.

@KADC you need to come up with a solution NOT delete data!  It's 100% wrong.  What you may be deleting as a spoiler may not be a spoiler to someone else!    Why don't you show us an example of a spoiler that is out on IMDB in your opinion and see if others have the same take.  Right now, I have not seen any keywords that should be viewed as a spoiler.  SHOW ME ONE!

a predefined list of keywords

A predefined list of keywords is a very bad idea.  It will take away from information needed to parents to make decisions on to allow their child to watch a movie or not.  Keywords need to be open and complete for each title in order to give everyone the information and tools they need.

Granted a phrase like "Darth Vader is Luke's father" A true spoiler should never be added as a keyword (which I have never seen on any title ever).  However, words like lightsaber, tiefighter, x -wing, starship, battle, or  keywords like "boy raises middle finger" or use of bad language or even nudity should all be included to give parents and others the ability to make a decision on what to watch.  If you limit the words to a simple list, then you take away form how IMDB is being used.  That is the wrong thing to do.

I think the simplist  solution whould be what I have suggested on a on/off setting in the account settings.  That way @KADC and others can turn it off they don't see things. And Others and myself can turn it on so we can.  No mouseovers or rollovers or clicking for each movie title.  Just a simple one time setting is all that is needed.  Then everyone can be happy.

@KADC​ 

I certainly hope no-one is re-adding spoiler keywords after they have been deleted. Anyone intentionally spoiling a movie should be reported and banned.

This is one the worst comments ever written on this message board about keywords.

In reality, it is the exact opposite of what you proposed: if you delete keywords that are relevant to a movie's plot simply because you regard the keywords as "spoilers," then you are the one who should be reported and banned.

Please don't destroy other people's work on IMDb simply because you are afraid of so-called "spoilers."

Beyond that, I will add something that hasn't yet been brought up on this thread. Very few keywords are typically regarded as inherent potential "spoilers" whenever used. For such keywords, IMDb has already designed its system to display those keywords at the very bottom of each keyword list, thus ensuring that the keywords will never appear at the top of a keyword page or in the first 5 keywords displayed on a title page. A couple example keywords are death of mother and death of father.

If there are other similar keywords that more often than not could be regarded as "spoilers" (another example might be death of parents), then feel free to propose them as keywords that should always be listed at the bottom of keyword lists.

But once again, keywords like that should never be deleted by users who regard them as spoilers.

@keyword_expert 

 A couple example keywords are death of mother and death of father.

I hope that loss of mother (ie. left, abandon, and death) and loss of father is as well, since they are similar but not the same. 

Also thank you for speaking up as well.  I hope no more keywords are delete.  Also is there a way IMDB could go back through what KADC has deleted and auto add them back in?

@mbmb​ 

Like this? https://web.archive.org/web/20100328143714/https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0068646/

Exactly!

That looked great that way: keywords being hidden, while really easy for people who want to see them to show them (just on mouse over).

It was great and making the most sense that way (IMDB was even warning they could contain spoilers), why did it change? Why doesn't IMDB consider this thing as potential spoilers anymore? Doesn't make sense to me.

Alternatively, the other option some people suggested (option to hide them in settings) would also sound good.

@jeorj_euler​ 

We just need a way to manually reorder keywords that have yet to be voted upon for relevance.

There already is an indirect way to do that (sort of): by voting on some keywords as relevant, thus moving those keywords to the top, higher than keywords that have yet to be voted on.

If a keyword is relevant but you don't want it to be anywhere near the top of the list, then simply leave that keyword alone and vote on other keywords to bring them to the top.

@bradley_kent​ I agree fully.

That is why the self-appointed morality spoiler police needs to stop deleting data.  

To be technical every keyword, every review, every plot, every synopsis, every trailer, heck even every poster is a spoiler for a movie.  

Trailers are nothing more than the producers showing off the best scenes to try to get you to come watch a movie. Looking at some of the trailers, you can know everything there is about a movie.   They don't hold back on them.  

IMDB needs to be complete, that means ALL keywords and the morality spoiler police need to be, as you put it, selective self-censored intake, and stop ruining things for everyone else.

I agree with @bradley_kent​. I dislike spoilers as much as the next person, and that's why I rarely visit a movie's IMDb page before I watch it, especially not immediately before watching it.