angelo_pilla's profile

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

Wed, Aug 7, 2019 4:21 AM

Glitch on the ratings system

Today an unusual number of movies had a drop in its ratings. Movies with 7.1 dropped to 7.0, movies with 7.0 dropped to 6.9 and so on. And I mean a lot of movies, which obviously points to a glitch, while there were almost no movies with crescent ratings. I know because I have a list of almost 2000 movies and I am constantly observing its ratings movements. Please, take a look and try to fix it. Thanks and sorry for my english.

Responses

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

2 y ago

It is unusual when it is in the same day. The movies on my list rarely drop, and yesterday it happened with a lot of movies. Besides it is a list of classics, old movies, so they should have a more steady rating. For example. yesterday How to Marry a Millionaire, The Other, Hairspray and The Grifters had dropped from 7.0 to 6.9. FOUR movies, when my list normally stays for months without any movie drop to 6.9.

Champion

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4.2K Messages

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109.7K Points

I can confirm 3 of those were recently 7.0 and now 6.9. I ran a script (this week) which stores data for mouse-over display, and these all show 7.0 on mouseover, but 6.9 on the live page:
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0099703/
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0095270/
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0045891/
(The 4th is not on one of my lists.)

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

And today Sisters (the Brian De Palma film) has dropped to 6.9.

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

Many other movies must have fallen but I only keep track of the 7.0 movies because this is a criteria for my list. In the last month, at least 10 movies on this list have dropped to 6.9 and NO ONE has gone to 7.1. 
Obviously there is a problem. 

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

2 y ago

I am an IMDb user for 24 years now. I know what I'm talking about.

Champion

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4.2K Messages

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109.7K Points

2 y ago

I've captured  some more data. Using one of my lists with 2600+ titles, I used ATS to look at the 276 titles currently rated 6.9 or 7.0. Using the mouseover data from earlier this week, I identified 51 of the 276 that declined in rating, and 3 that ascended. By exporting them, I've captured the number of votes, so we can look at them again later if needed.
Here's the export:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1y4PBDfYnk1rWIIC_aFoaC0g41Buo1XWbSTK4rPUVbh0/edit?usp=sharing
And here are the lists:
7Aug2019 Titles rated 6.9-7.0
276 titles 
7Aug2019 Titles that dropped this week
51 titles

Angelo, I'd be willing to extract similar data from your list, if you'd like to share its URL.

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

This confirms my suspicion that the ratings system has been altered in some way. What we need to know now is if it is an adjustment made deliberately or if it is an error. If only an IMDb representative could say something about this...
Well...here is my list:
https://www.imdb.com/list/ls070918528/?sort=alpha,asc&st_dt=&mode=detail&page=1

Champion

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4.2K Messages

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109.7K Points

Did you remove the 4 films (How to Marry a Millionaire, The Other, Hairspray and The Grifters) from your list, or is there another list where they appeared?

When I restrict this list to the 6.9-7.0 entries (100 of them), I only have mouseover data for 26 of them, and only 1 dropped this week (The Barefoot Contessa (1954) from 7.1 to 7.0).

Looking at the 20 films on that list rated below 6.9, I also found 
The Jazz Singer (1927) dropped from 6.7 to 6.6
The Birth of a Nation (1915) from 6.6 to 6.5
The Broadway Melody (1929) from 6.1 to 6.0
(I only had mouseover data for 9 of them.)

Given that Birth has 20,598 votes, how many votes would need to be under 6 to change the average from (speculating here) 6.45 (which should round to 6.5) to something that rounds to 6.4?  A single vote of 5 changes the average to 6.4499, which Google Sheets (correctly) rounds to 6.4. 

I'll wait to create a sublist until you confirm this is the correct list.

I am getting the itch to update my mouseover data (for other reasons), but am holding off for this thread.

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

This is the list. I have removed those movies to keep a better track of the changes. But you can look which movies had changed from 7.2 to 7.1, 7.3 to 7.2 and so on. 

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

Today two more movies from this list have dropped from 7.0 to 6.9: Nevada Smith and The Mechanic. I've already removed those from the list to keep a better track. It is really serious. 

Employee

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11.1K Messages

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247.2K Points

2 y ago

Hi Angelo -

I have reported your observations (as well as the other observations mentioned in this thread) to the appropriate technical team who will take a look, as soon as I have further information I will share the updates with you here.

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

Thanks, Michelle!

Champion

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4.2K Messages

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109.7K Points

2 y ago

Checked my list of 276 films with rating 6.9-7.0 created yesterday (22 hours ago as of this edit), and updated the spreadsheet to compare today's ratings.

I'm surprised to find that 24 films have changed rating, only 1 of which increased, AND that only 5 had a change in the number of votes:

Updated to show the 6 titles that dropped already this week.

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

Definitely there is a problem with the ratings. 

8.1K Messages

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184.5K Points

Maybe a whole bunch of sockpuppet accounts were uncovered and subsequently nuked.

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

No. There is a pattern. The movies which were going up are still going up in a normal pace. The movies which were going down are now going down in a way faster pace than usual. If IMDb don't fix this soon, all the ratings system will be ruined. 

8.1K Messages

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184.5K Points

Ruined? But for how long?

14 Messages

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994 Points

2 y ago

Angelo is absolutely right. I check this website https://250.took.nl/ every single day, it shows how the Top250 changes on a daily basis. And in the last couple of days, I have noticed that instead of 10-15 daily changes, it shows now every day approx. 100-150 changes, which is abnormal. I also noticed, the there is a drop only for old movies.

The list is really long, but just to mention some classics for today (9th of August): Casablanca, Star Wars, City Lights, Alien, Apocalypse Now, Vertigo, Dr. Strangelove, etc. I mean, the chance, that the ratings for all these movies drop on the same day is just simply impossible.

So either there is a failure in the system or someone - or a group - has registered multiple accounts which tasks is to get rid of the old ones from the list. Would be a pity though, if that would be possible.

Please, check it.
Peter


2K Messages

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65.7K Points

And in the last couple of days, I have noticed that instead of 10-15 daily changes, it shows now every day approx. 100-150 changes, which is abnormal. I also noticed, the there is a drop only for old movies.

I noticed the same thing. Old titles that have (almost) always been in the Top 250 are now gone. Perhaps there's no foul play and everything is as it should be, but it is very strange indeed that in a few days all the following titles have been deleted from the Top 250.

The Maltese Falcon (last Top 250 date August 2nd: https://250.took.nl/title/tt0033870)
The Wizard of Oz (last date: August 5th: https://250.took.nl/title/tt0032138)
Jaws (last date August 5th: https://250.took.nl/title/tt0073195)
Les Diaboliques (last date August 6th: https://250.took.nl/title/tt0046911)
The Grapes of Wrath (last date August 7th: https://250.took.nl/title/tt0032551)

8.1K Messages

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184.5K Points

Strange for it to happen so quickly.

22 Messages

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1.1K Points

Also The Exorcist, Beauty and the Beast, Donnie Darko, Dog Day Afternoon and others...

If this continues, i'm afraid in the next few days we 'll have to say goodbye to Gandhi, Groundhog Day (both huge drops in the last days), and then maybe Akira, Paris, Texas, Guardians of the Galaxy, Before Sunset, The Terminator...?? :(

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

2 y ago

Thanks, Péter. I think it is a failure because it is affecting all kinds of movies, with any kind of number of votes, not only the ones with 25000 votes or more. 
Since IMDb didn't solve the matter yet I think maybe should be a good idea if you create a new post specifically about the Top 250 issue. Maybe then they will be aware of how serious this problem is.

101 Messages

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3.3K Points

2 y ago

hi Angelo, check my thread as well:
https://getsatisfaction.com/imdb/topics/indian-movies-top-250?utm_source=notification&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=new_reply&utm_content=reply_button&reply[id]=20234321#reply_20234321

i've analyzed the movements in the top 250:
-russian, turkish, and most of all indian and some japanese and old movies went up more than 20 places in 2 weeks (movies that usually dropped a lot of positions in the last months)
-classics dropped more than 20 place while they usually kept the same spot for years.

I've seen that on the weekend (saturday and sunday) we have the same old chart: 10 changes only and the movies follows the "old" scheme
From Monday to Friday in the last 2 weeks looks like a guy is pressing some buttons to make movies go up and down from the list and adjusting their overall vote, weighting manually the vote.
It's a pity and i hope they will solve the issue soon.
I hope this week they won't make a mess again, instead in a month we'll see a whole 250 list filled with unknown Indian movies, while the classics sit outside the chart.

200.took.nl is perfect for analyzing such strange changes in the rating system.

Let's see what they will do... and if they want to give us some answers....

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

Hi, as you could see, the problem isn't affecting only the Top 250, but the whole site. Thousands of movies had suffered a suddenly and abrupt drop on its ratings. It looks like it has stopped now, but the ratings were not restored to the way they were a week ago. I hope they can fix this. 

795 Messages

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23.6K Points

2 y ago

I wonder if this is related to this thread where the same user has multiple reviews posted for the wizard of oz.
https://getsatisfaction.com/imdb/topics/how-to-report-a-same-user-profile-who-left-36-reviews-for-1-...

Although because they are rating it 10/10 they might be trying to keep it high, but some others might be using this glitch to lower others and raise others??

795 Messages

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23.6K Points

2 y ago

Ed as a fellow senior (although I'm less senior) I have to disagree. Some movies (and shows) are classics regardless of technology. Technology is certainly a facet, but do you rate movies solely on technology?  When I rate a movie I certainly look at tech, but also consider the acting, story, does it make me want to watch it again, something I would want to share, and several other angles I can't express.
I'd bet that I probably rate things more highly than you in general. Maybe it's because I'm not in the biz as you, so my standards are different.
Without looking I'm sure Oz has a 10 from me without looking, and I can't image lowering it. Off the top of my head another title would be Rikki-Tikki-Tavi. Animated nothing like what can be done today (like the Monsters movies), but to me it's simply a great story.
But I have to agree that I do change ratings on titles, but I tend to do so about equally up and down but it's not for what I think are considered "classics" or ground-breakers.
Just some thoughts from a bum.

8.1K Messages

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184.5K Points

I do wonder if some older pictures (that were extremely popular or acclaimed in their time) are marked mediocre simply for not being adequately politically correct or something such. To me, politics is like an infection of which the arts-and-sciences world just cannot be rid, likewise the identity politics facet of politics regularly invades other aspects of politics. However, I don't want to conflate political consciousness with simply the inability to identify with protagonists in one particular story or another, so I'm just not sure how various audiences may necessarily view things.

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

I love the classics too, but this is not the point. There is no one doing this "downgrading" manually. It is a glitch or an adjustment on the system. I think it is a glitch because it only affected the movies which were on a falling tendency on the ratings. If it was an adjustment it would affect the movies with crescent ratings too, I think. 

101 Messages

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3.3K Points

2 y ago

Somebody is clearly pushing some buttons to make movies go up and down.
Like I said, the weekend was ok with no huge movements and then.......it's now monday morning in the USA and we can see AGAIN some huge movements in the list.

At 9pm CET we had 10 movements in the top 250 (maximum +2 or -2 places)
At 10.30pm CET we have now 150 movements in the top 250 (maximum +5 places from russian, indian movies AGAIN).

this site is becoming useless. you know any other place with a clear rating system? is there a site where we can have some fun like we had on IMDB til a month ago ?

101 Messages

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3.3K Points

Ok and what is the point of eskyia gaining 30 position in 2 weeks while its arithmetic vote dropped down ? The worst votes it gets the higher the titles goes in the top 250

153 Messages

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7.5K Points

2 y ago

Yes, and today two more movies from my list of classics have turn from 7.0 to 6.9: Barabbas and Harper. When the things were normal this was very rare. It usually occured with no more than 5 movies a year. And no answers from IMDb staff yet. 

Champion

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4.2K Messages

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109.7K Points

2 y ago

Here's today's update of my sample of 276 titles which had a rating of 6.9-7.1 on 7Aug.
18 titles dropped, 3 rose.
Notice that only 1 title LOST VOTES, and that is a single vote. 
6 highlighted titles dropped for the 2nd or 3rd time since ~5Aug.
I did monitor the list over the weekend, and nothing changed then; these are all changes as of today.

To see the full spreadsheet, click here.
To see the 92 drops (some titles listed 2 or 3 times, see this list.

14 Messages

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994 Points

2 y ago

@bderoes thanks for the list, it shows really well that something is not right.
It is strange to see, that the rating of these movies dropped besides having the same number of votes.
Yeah, I believed for a minute the previous explanation stating that inactive accounts have been deleted, which btw would make sense, but than the number of votes should have dropped as well, so obviously there must be a glitch.

IMDB!!!!! PLEASE FIX THE ISSUE!

8.1K Messages

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184.5K Points

The following formula is used to calculate the Top Rated 250 titles. This formula provides a true 'Bayesian estimate', which takes into account the number of votes each title has received, minimum votes required to be on the list, and the mean vote for all titles:

weighted rating (WR) = (v ÷ (v+m)) × R + (m ÷ (v+m)) × C

Where:

R = average for the movie (mean) = (rating)

v = number of votes for the movie = (votes)

m = minimum votes required to be listed in the Top Rated list (currently 25,000)

C = the mean vote across the whole report

Please be aware that the Top Rated Movies Chart only includes theatrical features: shorts, TV movies, miniseries and documentaries are not included in the Top Rated Movies Chart. The Top Rated TV Shows Chart includes TV Series, but not TV episodes or Movies.

That appears to be the same as always.

14 Messages

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994 Points

2 y ago

One more thing. I am not checking the formula iMDB uses regularly.
Did someone notice any change? Or is it the same formula they use for years?
Because that would also explain the change.