Duplicate Keywords - List #75 (misc. sex keywords) (Proposals for Permanent Merger and Auto-Conversion)

@scgary66​ 

Aren't a few of those (deflowering, defloration, first-time-sex, etc.) better merged into loss-of-virginity?

"deflower" is defined by the dictionary as "to deprive (a woman) of virginity." As a result, the "deflowering" keywords can only be applied to women and girls, and these keywords are not synonyms for "loss-of-virginity," which can be applied to anyone.

As for "first-time-sex," I think that is broader than "loss-of-virginity," because "first-time-sex" can include oral sex and other types of sex, while "loss-of-virginity" involves genital sex.

Also, I believe erotica is more apt than eroticism.

True, but erotica is a film style (there have even been calls to make it a new genre on IMDb), while what we are talking about here is the adjective "erotic," which is not necessarily the same thing as "erotica." Some users have added "erotic" as a description of content where the content itself is not properly classified as erotica. It would thus be a mistake to merge "erotic" into "erotica."

And unless I'm mistaken, merging several others into sex rather than sex-scene might be problematic, as IMDb has generally reserved the former for genuine depictions (usually Adult titles) rather than dramatic depictions.

I thought about this too before posting this list. I did some investigation and concluded that while the vast majority of the applications of those keywords (e.g., "copulation") are intended to refer to sex scenes, the problem is that a few of them were not so intended. For keywords where 100% of the past usage definitely involves sex scenes (e.g., "fucking"), I proposed to merge those keywords into the keyword "sex-scene." But for anything less than 100%, I proposed merging into the keyword "sex." That avoids any inaccuracies or errors in the mergers, however slight they might be, and then once the auto-conversions are set up, in the future when people try to add one of these keywords (e.g., "copulation,"), the system will auto-convert to "sex" and they will receive the standard alert from IMDb that the keyword "sex" has been deprecated in favor of "sex-scene," and this will educate these contributors to stop using keywords like "copulation" in the future and instead use "sex-scene."

not all love scenes necessarily qualify as sex scenes.

True. I tried to look into this before posting, and it seems as if "love-scene" has been used as a vague euphemism for "sex-scene." Do you agree? Here is a link to all non-Adult titles that have the keyword "love-scene" but not the keyword "sex-scene."

https://www.imdb.com/search/title/?keywords=love-scene%2C!sex-scene&ref_=kw_ref_key&sort=moviemeter,asc&mode=detail&page=1

Do any of the 77 titles at that link not have a sex scene? If so, I would be willing to remove "love-scene" from this list.

@scgary66​ 

p.s. After looking into the keyword "love-scene" a little more closely, I do feel like some of the usage of this keyword might involve something different from a sex scene, so I will remove it from the list. I also noticed that "love-scene" has been applied to a few TV series, which should not have happened unless every single episode involves a "love scene."

There remains the question as to what exactly a "love scene" even is. Perhaps the keyword "love-scene" should instead be merged into "love." I may propose that later.

Since fucking is apparently only being added to adult titles it may be more relevant to redirect it to sex than to sex-scene.

@keyword_expert​ You note that: "deflower" is defined by the dictionary as "to deprive (a woman) of virginity." Aside from the fact that some dictionaries note only that it usually refers to a woman, I'll add that films including Call Me by Your Name, Kill Your Darlings and Closet Monster have defloration listed, as well as similar lesser-known and foreign-language titles. Anyway, I think deflowering would be preferable to defloration, as it's more widely used and better known.

@Peter_pbn​ 

I think it's the exact opposite. It's fine to add "sex-scene" to Adult titles, even if repetitive, and when one tries to add "sex" as a keyword to titles we get a warning that the "sex" keyword is disfavored and has been deprecated in favor of "sex-scene." So even though merging this one into "sex-scene" is kind of pointless, at least it wouldn't result in any errors. (The other option is to delete and block the "fucking" keyword altogether, which would also be fine.)

@scgary66​ 

I think deflowering would be preferable to defloration, as it's more widely used and better known.

I could probably go either way on that, but was still leaning toward "defloration."

In the past I have frequently changed "defloration" to "losing-virginity." But I was thinking here that "deflowering" should be merged into "defloration" for a few reasons. First, "defloration" is actually the slightly more common keyword on IMDb based on the numbers:

deflowering (117 titles)  -->  defloration (144 titles)

(And that's after I changed a dozen or so of the "defloration" keywords to "losing-virginity" long ago.)

Second, "defloration" is the noun form, while "deflowering" is the verb form. My dictionary defines "defloration" as "the act of deflowering." For IMDb keywords, nouns are typically preferred over verbs.

Third, "defloration" is also much more widely used on the Internet than "deflowering." I did a couple Google searches, and "deflowering" yields 6.7M results while "defloration" yields 56.7M results.

Fourth, "defloration" is also more popular in terms of titles on IMDb (47 titles vs. 35 titles). 

Finally, although I can't find it right now, I once saw an IMDb review using a term like "defloration movies" as in describing an entire genre of films. Apparently it's a "thing" for certain people. 

I know the word "defloration" sounds a bit weird, but I still think it's the appropriate word to use for the reasons I listed.

@keyword_expert​ As for the noun vs verb issue, deflowering is both. To use a related example, if I say, "I am cooking dinner," cooking is a verb; if I say, "I enjoy cooking," cooking is a noun. The same applies to jogging, reading, hunting, sleeping, studying, etc. (Think "The Running of the Bulls".) Likewise, if I were to say, "Edgar began deflowering Hortense," it's a verb; but if I say, "Hortense's deflowering took place in September," it's a noun. (And in your "defloration movies" example, it's an adjective.) I'll also note that while defloration might turn up more search results, a lot of them seem to use the word deflowering in the actual text. To me, defloration oddly sounds a bit like defoliation.

@scgary66​ I hear your points about nouns vs. verbs, but "defloration" is only a noun and never a verb in any context (and within the term "defloration movies" it's not really an adjective but rather a "noun as adjective," just like "war" in "war story"). 

When "defloration" and "deflowering" are compared side by side, "defloration" is the only permanent noun between the two. 

Also see this: https://wikidiff.com/deflower/defloration

As a verb deflower is to take the virginity of (somebody), especially a woman or girl.

As a noun defloration is the act of deflowering.

And yeah, "defloration" looks and sounds like "defoliation." It's actually not that odd if you think about it, though, because an alternate meaning of "deflower" is "to deprive or strip of flowers" so to deflower is the removal of flowers, while to defoliate is to remove leaves (or plants). It also looks a bit like "defluoridate," which means to remove or decrease fluoride. 

I wonder if anyone else wants to weigh in on the "defloration" vs. "deflowering" debate. 

Re: sexual-intercourse (536 titles)  -->  sexual-encounter (37 titles)  -->   sexual-encounters (1 title)  -->  intercourse (145 titles)  -->  coitus (551 titles)  -->  copulation (395 titles)  -->  fornication (54 titles)  -->  having-sex (5 titles)  -->   sex (109302 titles)

sexual-encounter, sexual-encounters and having-sex can easily and understandably be merged into "sex."

But... While "sexual-intercourse," "intercourse," "coitus," "copulation," and "fornication" can probably be merged into one individualized keyword, that keyword (these keywords) SHOULD NOT just be merged into the "sex" keyword. They are (it is) only one "kind" (type, subgenre) of sex involving a penis entering a vagina.  Sex also includes fellatio, cunnilingus, anal sex, analingus (including rimming), hand job, pedophilia, necrophilia, mechanophilia, etc, which may also need the more general "sex" keyword, but are specific sexual activities that should retain their individualized keywords as well.

And, although I realize that it will NEVER be agreed to, I still believe that the correct keyword for Adult titles is "sex-scene" rather than "sex" since ACTUAL sex scenes are involved in every Adult title.  Certainly, some non-adult titles have sex scenes and need the "sex-scene" keyword, but the "sex" keyword should be used only for non-adult titles. "Sex" is automatically understood as a keyword for EVERY Adult title.

@bradley_kent​ 

And, although I realize that it will NEVER be agreed to, I still believe that the correct keyword for Adult titles is "sex-scene" rather than "sex" since ACTUAL sex scenes are involved in every Adult title. 

Actually I think we all can agree to that. And even better than "sex-scene" as a keyword for Adult titles is the keyword "hardcore." That is a special keyword that, once added to titles, converts the title to an Adult title. But back to your point, "sex-scene" is definitely preferred over "sex" for all Adult titles.

@keyword_expert​ 

It's fine to add "sex-scene" to Adult titles, even if repetitive, and when one tries to add "sex" as a keyword to titles we get a warning that the "sex" keyword is disfavored and has been deprecated in favor of "sex-scene."

The message specifies that it applies to non-adult titles, and the guidelines mention sex as a keyword that is applied to adult titles.

Perhaps you should ask IMDb about this issue to understand it better.

@Peter_pbn​

Good point. I was forgetting the part about the guidelines mentioning not only "hardcore," but rather "hardcore" in combination with "sex" for Adult titles:

What do you think about the idea of just deleting and blocking the "fucking" keyword altogether (rather than merging it into another keyword)?

@bradley_kent​ 

Scratch what I said earlier about "sex-scene" being the preferred keyword for Adult titles. I think @Peter_pbn is correct that it should instead be "sex" + "hardcore" if we're talking about Adult titles. As Peter points out, that's what the guidelines say.

@Peter_pbn​ 

I went ahead and changed the list so that the "fucking" keyword would merge into "sex," as you originally suggested.