H

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

Wed, Jan 5, 2022 3:39 AM

Solved

Deleting erroneous credits is not getting approved even with ample evidence

I spent a while fleshing out cast credits for The Secret World of Alex Mack (1994-1998), and although most of the additions and corrections finally made it through with clear supporting evidence (screenshots and videos of the episode credits), the matter of getting a few incorrect credits deleted is proving much harder. There is one series regular who is not in every episode, and yet is listed here for 8 he's not in. There are a few others with superfluous credits, as well, plus one extra who was listed for the wrong episode (I got the right episode added but can't remove the wrong one), and one "credited as" that I can't get to stick out of a dozen or so for which footage of the credits was otherwise sufficient.

When these submissions are rejected, I get either "unable to verify" or "more evidence required" as the answer. I'm not sure what other evidence I *can* provide, short of going to an IMDb editor's house and screening the full episodes! These are extremely easy things to verify, especially since the series regular credits run at the start of each episode AFTER the episode title, and there aren't secret or nonspeaking appearances by uncredited regulars - they're just NOT IN those episodes. PLEASE tell me what I can do to finish setting the record straight! I understand that deleting factual information would be a bad thing, but this is deleting information that was never based in fact to begin with, and I wish I knew why this wasn't enough proof, OR why editors are apparently so eager to believe the unsubstantiated original data.

Employee

 • 

13.4K Messages

 • 

271.2K Points

4分前

Hi htwh -

Regarding the credit for the series regular, to clarify, is this person credited on the episode but not featured on the episode?  Or are they neither credited nor featured?

Can you also post the 18-digit submission reference numbers associated with these recently declined submissions?  I can then investigate further.

Cheers!

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

@Michelle​ These are neither credited nor featured (there are "creditOnly" attributions elsewhere but they all seem correct). The series had opening titles with the five main cast, then running credits that (apart from a few guest appearances) included regulars who would be in some episodes and not others. Benjamin Smith is one of those, as are some more I list below.

These are the submission numbers, by person, and please note the shared folder with the video evidence for each episode.

Benjamin Smith:

Suspect 211212-230304-796000

Trophy Case 211212-230608-360000

Saturn 211212-230722-775000

Nerve 211214-010539-153000

Triangle 211214-010637-363000

Friends Like That 211214-010724-562000

Green Day 211205-212916-253000

Camping 211205-213254-432000

Storm 211205-214308-818000

Alexis Fields:

Lies and Secrets 211219-220611-588000

Paradise Lost 211219-221052-448000

Louan Gideon:

Lies and Secrets (see Alexis above)

Charlotte Lopez:

Friendly Fire 211219-220242-532000

and not a deletion but a credited-as correction, Without Feathers 220103-231204-478000

Finally for now, there is a half-finished change of an uncredited appearance from one episode to another on Ashleigh Prince. The credit on BMX is done, the one for Senora Garcia should be removed; I got email confirmation from her and also combed through the episode to be sure she's not in that one. (211218-153101-212000)

Let me know if you need any clarification, and also if there is any way to smooth out the process in the future. After we get these straightened out, I have a few listed-as-"uncredited" nonappearances to look into as well, but first things first. Thanks!

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

Oh - as one point of clarification, Charlotte Lopez is *not* a series regular (as the others listed above her are). Her credits always came in the end titles, and you can verify the absence (and credited-as) there.

Employee

 • 

13.4K Messages

 • 

271.2K Points

4分前

Hi htwh -

Thanks for clarifying and providing the evidence link within your submissions.  I have now approved these credit deletions/corrections, the changes should be live on the site shortly.

Cheers!

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

@Michelle PROBLEM.​ I am seeing the changes roll in, but several of them are the wrong episodes!

Louan Gideon was left on Lies and Secrets, but taken off Senora Garcia (which she IS in).

Alexis Fields was left on Lies and Secrets and Paradise Lost, but taken off Mystery Man and Images (which she IS in).

I'm watching the progress on Smith and Prince. I hope those go OK!

By the way, on Without Feathers, since the end credit people are listed alphabetically (according to current name), is there any way to get them in line with the episode credits/does it matter? If I add numbers to sort them, it will treat them all as above-the-line credits.

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

Now Gideon and Fields seem to be OK (I wonder if there was a weird side effect of the changes rippling through), and I'll keep my eye on the rest (2 of 9 Smith deletions have gone through). For the additional deletions, please let me know if I should enumerate them in this thread; if I do not hear back I will assume it is no longer being checked and will start a new one. Thanks for your help so far!

Employee

 • 

13.4K Messages

 • 

271.2K Points

4分前

Hi htwh -

All the updates for these episodes should have been made live.  Can you take a look and confirm if there are any outstanding issues?

For "Without Feathers", you can submit updates to the existing credits to include the correct credit order numbers, which will adjust the cast list order accordingly on the site. 

Cheers!

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

@Michelle​ About half didn't seem to take. But I'm sure we can get it finished up! I appreciate the help so far.

For Benjamin Smith, these 7 episodes remain to be unlisted. Here are the titles and update numbers; the supporting evidence is all in the shared folder linked within.

Saturn 211212-230722-775000

Nerve 211214-010539-153000

Triangle 211214-010637-363000

Friends Like That 211214-010724-562000

Green Day 211205-212916-253000

Camping 211205-213254-432000

The Storm 211205-214308-818000

There are also four uncredited listings I believe to be erroneous. In order from most to least certain:

1. Natanya Ross in 2.17/Carnival. She's just not in it; I've walked through the episode to be sure. (Episode credits are in shared folder.) No reference number for this one as I had not submitted it previously as a deletion.

2. Ashleigh Prince in 4.10/Senora Garcia. The credits on BMX+Spivey are correct, the one for Senora Garcia should be removed; I got email confirmation from her (see folder) and also combed through the episode to be sure she's not in that one. (211218-153101-212000)

3. Jen Morris as Lindsay in 2.3/New Kid in Town. This character was introduced a year later in Bad Girl and this listing was probably a mistake, especially since the episode title could confuse someone.

4. Valerie Dillman as Ms. Scoonover in 3.24/Nightmare in Paradise. This character was introduced the next season in Senora Garcia as a new substitute, and since that credit didn't exist until my addition a few months ago I think that was also just put on the wrong episode.

For both 3 and 4 I've gone through the episodes closely looking for such characters, or even just the actresses, in the background, but came up dry. I think the case is good but you can use your best judgment and let me know if you need more evidence, or maybe they were put in with ironclad evidence I am not aware of. In all cases, the people involved do have other credits on this show so there's not a full unlinking of them from it!

For "Without Feathers", my question is mostly whether it's best to save numbered credit order for various kinds of top billing instead of the supporting players relegated to the end credits (in this TV format). I can live with the alphabetization if it's better practice overall.

Thanks again! I'll check on the progress and let you know if it's ready to close out.

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

Quick addendum to uncredited deletions:

1b. Natanya Ross is also not in 1.8/The Feud. Again, I've walked through the episode to be sure. End credits screenshots are in the shared folder and for season 1 Natanya was only ever listed in the end, which I mention to at least confirm she has no credit. To prove she's not in the episode is up to how much you believe me and how much you want to seek out the episode to walk through it too!

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

4分前

@Michelle I haven't heard back on this followup (the remaining deletions that have not gone live). Can you look into it please?

Employee

 • 

13.4K Messages

 • 

271.2K Points

4分前

Hi htwh -

My sincere apologies for the delay.  I have now made all the remaining credit adjustments as per your reports above, and the changes should be live on the site shortly.

For "Without Feathers", if the cast list is split between the opening credits and end credits; in this case, the two portions should be treated as one long cast list that happens to be interrupted by the show.   So you can start the order with the opening cast names, then complete the ordering for the cast listed in the end credits.

Lastly, this was one of my favorite shows growing up, so I truly appreciate all your effort to correct the data! 

Thanks again!

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

@Michelle​ With one small error, things are looking very good. That error is that Natanya Ross was taken off 1.12/The Solo (which she is in, credited) and left in 1.8/The Feud. Could you rectify that?

I did indeed set the Feathers order (after noticing several other episodes that did the same, before your reassurance came through), and I like the way you put it, that the credits are all one chunk with a pesky episode in the middle.

I'm happy to help and even happier to know this recourse is available for tricky cases! Accuracy is important. I wish I could do more, of course. And this show is also meaningful to me (it helped that I was the same age as Alex and classmates!), and making it through the complete series DVD set was a really nice time, with a surprisingly emotional finale. Revisit it yourself - it holds up!

Employee

 • 

13.4K Messages

 • 

271.2K Points

Hi @htwh​ -

Thanks for these last touch-ups, I have now adjusted Natanya Ross' credits for these two episodes (removed "The Feud"/re-added "The Solo").  If you notice any other errors that you need help with in the meantime let us know. 

Thanks again, I definitely plan to revisit this series soon!

11 Messages

 • 

170 Points

@Michelle​ OK, then all seems good. I really really appreciate the assistance. If I spy anything else in need of fixing and can't do it myself, I'll use a new thread, and we can consider this one wrapped! (Thanks, and enjoy!)