jen_264364's profile
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Fri, Jul 27, 2018 7:07 AM

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Suggestion: Networks Pass on Women-Led Pilots

When the 2018 Upfronts happened many in the business where surprised by the pilots which weren't picked. Maybe of them had big stars and/or built-in audiences and were considered slam dunks, yet where still ignored in the end. Coincidentally all of them are led by women. Interesting, eh? Perhaps it's not so much of a coincidence...

Which of these recent pilots that weren't chosen to become series sounds the most interesting to you?

List: https://www.imdb.com/list/ls024763899

Responses

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3 y ago

I don't know. Quite frankly, I just want my astronaut mom to get a proper sendoff.

 

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3 y ago

Get Christie Love, Cagney & Lacey & have stars from orig Cagney & Lacey do cameo ( video feed, live walk on role).

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3 y ago

My vote:
The Finest (2018 TV Movie)

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3 y ago


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3 y ago

Love You More for all us pleasantly plump woman out there

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3 y ago

I trust your word Jen, but still, you really mean that these are all the pilots that weren't picked? And they all happen to be directed or led by women? 

I'm not saying it's hard to believe but I think there have been too many polemics these last years,related to genders, ethnicities, sexualities etc. and I try to be more optimistic and go beyond all the temptation of 'conspiracies' thoughts, like seeing some male agenda or anti-female bias from TV producers... as related to your example. I think there are many successful TV series with great female leads, or directed and written by women but the tone of your intro suggests that... the fight isn't over yet.

For me, it's a matter of the way you look at the glass, anyone who believes his gender or community or ethnicity or physical attribute (not many shows about short-overweight-plain-looking guys) is being  wronged by the media will find every sign indicating that it's true, and the same goes for the most optimistic side.

I think there's both an optimistic and pessimistic truth in everything, so how about looking at the one that makes us happier... maybe these things happened... maybe I'm being naive... maybe it's all a coincidence... I refuse to believe that all the people working on these networks and who terminated these shows were 100% men... and if a powerful executive woman found one of these shows unappealing, well, the way she exercised her power can also be regarded as a triumph of female decision-making... all women aren't blindly pro-women after all. And shouldn't be.

Cheers!

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In "absolute" terms, I would agree with you Vic, but...

... I think everything is relative, time is, distance is, why shouldn't numbers? See, if there are ten female directors among 90 guys, okay, it's not good. But what if there were only twenty female candidates for 900 guys, that would mean 1 guy out of 10 got picked and 1 woman out of 2, it gives you a whole other view on the same reality.

Now, I guess the problem would be: why aren't there more women who want to be directors, maybe because there aren't many women who want to be directors... for the moment. And it's as simple as that. 

And what should be the solution anyway? Imagine a directing school for horror movies just opened and they only have 100 places, there are 1000 male applicants and 200 female, what would be the best option? selecting from the resume? or making it a 50-50 quota? what would be the fairest option? If the resume option leads to 99 women and 1 man, it'd be fine for me, but I have a feeling that the opposite solution would provoke allegations of anti-female bias... or plain subjectivity.

Seriously, I'm happy for anyone who succeeds in anything, I really am, and the more competitive or tough the field is, the stronger is my admiration but people should stop whining when things don't happen the way they wish it would or because there's not enough or this or not enough or that, that's what gives us millennials such a bad press. Well, i'm a '82, I don't know how much a millennial I am but I'm no Xer... and I used to whine a lot... till recently.

I understand works of art are the reflection of one's sensitivity or subjectivity, and some are more needed because they are less present for the moment.. but I'm pretty sure everything can be done without any polemics, complaints or quotas.

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That's not exactly what I said... I'm only saying it's not a "men" vs. "women" thing, maybe i'm too naive for such a conception or maybe that's just too "binary" for my thinking. 

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My only "problem", for lack of a better word, with the feminist fight or the pro-women cause is that it puts men and women in separate categories, indirectly or unconsciously assuming (not saying it's deliberate) that any guy, on the sole basis of his gender, belongs to the "winning team", so to speak.

I know and you certainly know many male adults, regardless of their professional or artistic aspirations, who are struggling maybe more than women because of handicapping parameters (physical, social, ethnical...).

I worked in marketing and communication for ten years and I can tell you that in business or job forums, being a woman was an asset, also you can agree that to work for TV, looking good on TV is important, and if you look at 'heightism' on Wikipedia, you'll realize that guys with a short height are struggling more than tall ones while height is rarely an issue for women.

I'm not saying it's not "men vs. women" because it doesn't exist, but because reality works in complex ways, and we're all seeing the problems that touch us on a personal level, sometimes ignoring that other people can feel underestimated, ignored and/or wronged for various reasons, even men.

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The cause is unknown.

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I never thought you even implied that "woe is me" feeling, I think it's only my own experience speaking, not saying my overview of life is indicative of any objective reality but what I try to never judge the work of someone on a gender basis, except when gender, or something like the ethnic background or the spirituality, has brought a specific sensitivity to the subject...

What you said about horror movies was interesting, I was thinking maybe it has to do with the genre not appealing too much to women (most women I know are turned off by horror movies) but then maybe it's because that many tropes "popularized" by horror movies directed by huys and that contained a strong anti-female bias like the infamous 'damsels in distress', have a look at this, it might interest you:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8hj66FIFmw

and that was in the 80s.

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I wonder whether Siskel and Ebert amnestied some of the 80's slasher movies after a string of modern "torture porn" type of movies. Also, as some people suggested in the comments, Friday the 13th (1980) is not a good example of that, as killer, despite initial man-like appearance turns out to be a woman. As far as I remember Ebert also bashed Maniac (1980) for being too violent despite he walked off the movie, effectively missing the point that Frank Zito's horrendous mental state was a result of child abuse. Movie was such a manifesto against child abuse on Joe Spinell's part that it's hard for me to imagine that it was viewed as an anti-feminist movie at the time. It's a pity Spinell never completed (mostly spiritual) sequel Maniac 2: Mr. Robbie (1986) because judging from what they filmed it could have made the point much more clear and precise, striking the right cord with the audience. 

Personally, I like slasher films and I don't think of them as hateful for any specific category (at least genre at a whole was not trying to do that, some particular movies might). The main appeal in the genre for me is a ping-pong like change of perspective back-and-forth between the killer and the victim. It provides for a very suspenseful and captivating perspective and, done right, it also shows that despite multiple advantages, killer often turns out to be either outsmarted and/or beaten by survivors. Killer in the slasher film is often a superhuman-like menace, an unstoppable force hitting a classic immovable object.  

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Hi, ElM. Do you have an suggestions for how the list subject heading or list description should be reworded?

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3 y ago

Elm,

The problem is far worse in the States than it is in other countries. And, yes, those weren't ALL of the pilots not picked up, but they were a large percentage. 

I do my research - I'm not just making this stuff up.

And as far as the plain-looking or short or overweight guys not getting their own shows, here you go:
The World According to Jim
Last Man Standing
Kevin Can Wait
The Big Bang Theory
Still Standing
Modern Family
Bob Newhart Show
Grounded for Life
The Honeymooners
George Lopez
Get Smart
That '70s Show
Just the Ten of Us
Curb Your Enthusiasm
The Drew Carey Show
The King of Queens
The Jeffersons
My Name is Earl
NewsRadio
3rd Rock from the Sun
Just Shoot Me
Yes Dear

And those are just the sitcoms off the top of my head.

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They're all comedies, so they have the right look ...

You won't see a Jack Bauer looking like George Constanza, even when it's not comedies, they always play neurotic / loser-type of guys. And you won't see these guys topping the list of most bankable stars... not that it's a crime :)

By the way, I wasn't specific about TV; just in general, either you have or you don't have the "Givenchy" look.

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3 y ago

Image result for boxing woman

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2 y ago

rampant misogyny

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With all due respect, I think that's too bold and simplistic a statement, there's something rotten in the business, definitely, but that case is not an illustration of how women really get it bad.

Why should anyone's interest toward a series or a story depend on the lead protagonists gender anyway? Not saying misogyny doesn't exist in general, it exits everywhere so unfortunately, media are no exception but this series' thing is a false trial... we don't know why these series were rejected and if a pilot was made in the first place, it still means that the concept was given a shot.

For me "misogyny" is such an ugly thing, it's really about hating women, plain and simple, which is a serious issue... so you can't just trivialize it by associating it to any situation or news item that only consists on raising a valid but still uncertain question. Same goes with "racism", "abuse" and other ugly words...

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I also fail to see how the people behind the decisions were or are misogynists.